How To Choose Your Next Carb

Discussion in 'Fuel System' started by Muel, Oct 12, 2016.

By Muel on Oct 12, 2016 at 11:00 AM
  1. Muel Article Contributor Oregon Chapter

    OK, Here is the answer to the "What Carburetor should I use?", question that has popped up regularly; well it may not be the answer but it is my answer. Carburetors are Carbs, and a Four Barrel Carburetor is a 4BBL from this point on.

    Basics:

    A Carb is a simple, yet complex fuel metering device that uses the difference in pressure above and below the venturi (s) to pull fuel into the air stream through a series of metering orifices. It doesn't matter what type or brand the Carb is or even what size they all work basically the same way.

    If you are using the common Carb Manufacturer's formula to determine the Cubic Feet per Minute (CFM) requirement for your engine:

    CFM = Cubic Inches x RPM / 2 / 1728​

    Where:

    • CFM: Cubic Feet per Minute, of air flow.
    • Cubic Inches: the Engine Size.
    • RPM: The RPM that you want to know the flow at. Generally this will be the maximum RPM that you intend the engine to see.
    • 2: corrects for the 4 stroke nature of our engines.
    • 1728: a constant that turns Cubic Inches in to Cubic Feet You must accept that the results are intended to select a Carb for a 100% Volumetrically Efficient engine. Volumetric Efficiency (VE) is the measure of the engines breathing efficiency. Race engines can reach VE's that exceed 100% while most street engines are between 65 an 80% with some well tuned street engines in the 90% VE range.
    You can not directly compare the CFM rating between 2BBL's and 4BBL's as the test pressure that is used to measure the CFM is different between the two. The 4BBL is measured at a test pressure of 1.5 inches of Mercury (Hg) of pressure drop, while the 2BBL is rated at 3 inches HG. To convert the 2BBL into 4BBL use the following formula:

    4BBL Flow = 2BBL Flow / 1.414.
    So that 500 CFM 2BBL Carb actually flows 353.606 CFM on the 4BBL scale

    Size:

    The size of a Carb for a given engine combination is "always" a compromise! The 300 to 460 cubic inch class of engines can use Carb's that range from 300 to 2400 Cubic Feet per Minute (CFM). The rather simple formula listed above will give you a vary safe CFM rating for a given size engine. This formula (and others like it) are "vary" conservative by design; Holley and Carter, Et-al recognize that a Carb that is too "small" has a better chance of working out of the box then one that is to "big". What size is right then? Between 300 & 460 Ci. on the street a Carb that is rated at 500 to 1000 CFM is going to work. 1000 CFM on a 300 Ci engine won't work!

    Yes I can hear you!, and your right it won't work if you just take the Carb out of the box and bolt it onto your stock engine. It can work if you have the engine combination that produce a demand that "matches the Carb". For example the 780 and 800+ CFM Rochester's were used quite successfully on engines as small as 302 CI. In general though that stock 300 cube engine will be much happier with the 500 CFM Carb. If this engine has a good set of full length headers, mild camshaft and a good intake manifold a Carb in the 650 to 750 CFM range will produce better power in the mid to top ranges of engine operation.

    So there is a trend here; On the street use a smaller CFM rating on smaller displacements and the inverse on big displacement engines. There is a further trend use a smaller carb in applications where your demand for power is in the lower half of the engine operation range. There are exceptions to these trends. Many times changing a Carb to a larger one will yield more power everywhere in the power band.

    This brings us to the ultimate rule:
    "Give the engine what it wants, not what you, your buddies, or some Magazine think it wants and you will be rewarded with power."

    How do you find out what the engine wants? That is simply a matter of trial and error. As a general starting point I use the following guideline, This is simply the results of my experience and nothing more.

    Engine Displacement -VS- CFM:
    289 - 302 Stock 500 CFM Mild 600/750 CFM Race 750/UP CFM
    351 - 400 Stock 600 CFM Mild 650/750 CFM Race 800/UP CFM
    400 - 460 Stock 650 CFM Mild 750/850 CFM Race 900/UP CFM
    460 - UP Stock 750 CFM Mild 750/900 CFM Race 1000/UP CFM

    How much will it cost to do this "Trial and Error" approach, well... I have spent literally thousands.

    Brand: What Brand should I use?

    What Brand do you like? Are you going to work on it?

    If you know how to make Brand "X" work in your application then use that one.

    My experience has lead me to make these general recommendations. If you are playing on the street any of them will work with the difficulty in tuning them becoming a factor. In my humble opinion the Rochester is the most complex and parts can be hard to find. The Holley comes in a close second but parts are everywhere, and so are "experts"; so it is easier from that stand point. The simplest are the Carter's, parts are available almost everywhere

    Off road poses another set of problems.

    Carbs like to work in a stable environment; that is to say they don't like to be tilted in any direction and they don't like to be shaken. The Holley's are more sensitive to this due to their float bowl design and therefore I do not as a rule recommend them, they can be made to work, but it takes just that, plus time, plus money. The Rochester's and Carter's on the other hand are much more tolerant of the Off Road environment, and so get my recommendation for this application; with the Carter being my personal favorite.

    If your going racing, on or off road, your are going to be ether limited to a specific Carb, or size, or both: and or none. In all of these cases get the best Carb that you can afford and get it even if you can't! Contact Barry Grant or Braswell (there are others) and have it built! You'll be ahead of the game and competition!

    Conclusions:

    Out of the box.

    I have had the best luck with Carter's and then Holleys and lastly Rochester's for just bolting them on and having them work. By work I mean that the engine started and ran "OK" with the Air Fuel mixture being close enough that the engine was not going to melt down. No Carb is ever correct right out of the box, period!

    For making power.

    The Holley is the hands down winner, this is simply a result of more people spending more time tweaking the Holley than all of the others combined. This is not to say that the Holley is the only power producer, in the hands of someone who knows how, all of them can be made to make power.

    If you are new to aftermarket Carbs how do you pick one? Setting my opinions and everyone else's aside start by getting all of the Manufacturers information that you can lay your hands on and read it until you think that you understand your options. Pick a size that is the same as or just slightly larger then what ever the factory used for a stock application, and start learning. Give yourself plenty of time, with out some type of dynamometer it may take you a year after you get the engine driveable to get a carb optimized for your particular engine, and right foot (or you might get lucky and nail it on your first try!). To shorten this process buy or build an O2 Sensor(s), or two if you have dual exhaust these devices are simply invaluable in Carb tuning. The price of an O2 sensor should be included in your Carb budget if maximum performance is your goal I.E.: Power and Economy.

    For those of you who have read this far, I'll share a secret; There is no such thing as too big a Carb. What happens is the signal from the engine to the Carb is effectively reduced as the Carb gets bigger. If the signal gets too small the Carb can't hear it so to speak, When the engine is running at low RPM's the engine is whispering, as the RPM's increase the engine's voice rises louder until it is singing loudly. The Carb interprets not hearing anything as no signal, and shuts off the gas! The louder the song the more gas the Carb sends. The trick then is to have a Carb with super hearing! These Carbs are expensive to get and do not come out of any of the big three's boxes regardless of what they say and perhaps more importantly what the magazines say! I have known people that have the ability to make huge Carbs work on small engines, and they have consistently been the ones that cross the finish line first, (or their customers do!) but generally most people never do get it right.

    "Predator" Carb's deserve a mention. They have a following and the basic design has been around for something like 30 years. I think that the first time that I saw one it was called a "Kendig" which should date me. I have little experience with this design which is unlike any conventional design. The Predator is a variable ventury design, in that the internal size changes with the engine demand. I have heard good reports by those that I know that have run them. I have also heard that they can cause fuel distribution problems on intake manifolds that have been refined specifically for the Holley flange Carb. When I have more experience with this Carb I will add to this section. Until then this is it.

    I should note that Edelbrock Carbs are exact functional clones of the originals, while their advertising touts them to be vastly superior in reality there just is no practical difference in my experience.

    For one of the best general books on Carb's get yourself a copy of: David Vizard's "How to Build Horsepower Vol. 2, Carburetors & Intake Manifolds" ISBN 1-884080-14-3, SA Design.

    By C. Samuel Mountain Machine Company Portland, Oregon.

    All of the above is my opinion, it is based on fire, smoke, broken parts, fast times, tight corners, deep mud, good beer , better bourbon, and all of the costs that go with each of them. I retain all of the rights of my opinions in their entirety. If you infringe on any of my rights be certain that I will assert my legal right to justice. If you listen to my opinion (whether you agree or disagree) and then act on it in any way you are solely responsible for those actions and the results there of.
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2016
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    Big Red, jniolon, Greywolf and 3 others like this.

Comments

Discussion in 'Fuel System' started by Muel, Oct 12, 2016.

    1. Greywolf
      Greywolf
      Well written, and you include one formula (4bbl vice 2bbl) that I had not run across before.

      The popular Edelbrock 4bbl that turns up installed on a lot of rods and race cars these days (which is actually made by Weber) is a good choice for a lot of beginners, because it has a vacuum operated secondary - the BIG butterfly throttle plate that can often cause purely mechanical setups to dump all of their vacuum. This was once known as "Cleveland GULP", and it is when you don't have enough flow through the carb to properly mix fuel in a useful ratio.

      With a vacuum operated secondary - if the vacuum in the manifold and the carb venturies drops down too low, the secondaries begin to close back down until there is enough flow (resulting in vacuum) to pull the linkage open again.

      *Think of it as self adjusting stall protection

      Be aware of this if that great big Holley double pumper on the shelf at the local speed shop starts to look real attractive! Both Holley's and Edelbrocks come with vacuum secondaries, but Holleys also come with a purely mechanical setup - and that is used for wide open racing. Make sure which one you are getting. Vacuum secondaries have a much wider range on the street, are a lot more fuel efficient, and far more controllable through all driving ranges.

      And truly - there is no such animal as a carburetor that is as efficient fuel-wise, or as instantly correcting for all driving conditions, as a fuel injection system. EFI is also highly tunable and modifiable - so don't be too quick to jump out there and go old style if EFI is what you have to begin with.


      ~Dutch J.
    2. IDMooseMan
      IDMooseMan
      I love these types of articles. It's like a refresher course for something you already understand, but still missed "something" important about the topic.

      "Cleveland Gulp" is term I have not heard in several decades. Thanks for that one, Dutch, and you're correct about EFI, but there is just something about the mystique of a carburetor.
    3. Big Red
      Big Red
      like i have expected this site awsome. boom!!! thanks for the insight,,,more article please..
    4. FTZ HAIC
      FTZ HAIC
      Big Red, we have a lot more articles in the pipeline! :)

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